what the political environment, the culture on the hill, will accommodate. if the dave camp and sander levin cut a deal on the ways and means committee? >> begin the process and see what they can produce then begin the process of trying to confer. if there's a new revenue source, carbon tax, some sort of consumption tax, it will emerge out of their common frustration. that they can't get where they need to know. so don't micromanage or be prescriptive. give them the ratio of expend reductions to tax reform revenue enhancements, give that task, this fall, the committee and over the next six or nine months, task them to meet those numbers. i think the capabilities -- capability is there to do it. there's a will and i believe there is, with the president and john boehner, they will get the job tone. >> could i just add an amendment to what he's saying? i don't think it's credible to kick the can down the road that far at this point. i think that the reaction in the real economy would be devastating. so you have to kind of imagine what you're suggesting, vic, wh